Podcast – Episode 62: Cymru am byth (yn y cach)

31 responses

1. I have a huge amount of time for this site and really enjoy the articles and podcasts. The swearing on your last pod cast really drags it down and does nothing to assist the expression of the points viewed. Please can I ask that this does not happen again. Your work is thoughtful and enjoyable. Swearing just does not fit

   1. Hi Bravedart. Feedback on swearing has always been mixed but our default position is we don’t usually swear. However I don’t insist on this with guests as I prefer them to relax and speak freely. This week we’ve put out two versions of the pod and one has swearing removed so people can choose which to listen to. Normal service will resume next week but we might do something like this from time to time depending on guests.

   2. Thanks for listening. I’m really grateful for the feedback. It’s good to know there’s support for our usual non sweary approach

   3. I preferred it with the swearing. It seemed more relaxed and natural.

2. Thanks Cammy. Appreciate the reply and thanks again for a very good site. Now just to win on saturday.

3. Hi Cammy,

   I understand both views on swearing and not swearing and doesn’t overly bother me particularly but I think when folks appreciate the fact you don’t when other similar podcasts aren’t so careful it’s good to keep that the norm. Ppl may just turn off if kids listen in which would be ashame. Bleeping out would just create loads of questions if my kids listened.

   One thing I’m a little confused with is Ian Hay not a regular contributor so why is he swearing? Was it just cause ur other guest was so he felt he could as well?

   Keep up the good work and having discovered other rugby podcasts recently yours is still my favourite with the quirks and humour. Have the jingles been binned now? Maybe I’m out voted but I think it adds a lot to the whole feel. Feel free to continue to add the topping and tailing random clips. They also add to the whole feel. 😊

   1. I gave Iain permission to swear this week. He’s usually very good at controlling himself so I felt like I owed him one episode to let rip.
      I take the point on the bleeping out. I’ll probably ask guests to be careful in future as when I was editing I kept missing the odd one so it’s maybe too much of a risk.
      Jingles certainly haven’t been binned. They will be back in full force next week!

4. To be honest, I am not really sure how many children would listen to the podcast – it’s always been directed at adults IMO.

   Swearing for swearing’s sake is daft, but I doubt you’d ever go down that route – rugby evokes strong emotions and I dare the most po face puritan to deny they swore at the end of the Cardiff 2010 match.

   1. I know of at least three families that like to listen together. When we started the aim was to produce something like On The Ball but for rugby because I used to like listening to that with my Dad on a Saturday.
      It’s not generally a problem until we talk about something that stirs the emotions. Probably just as well we weren’t able to record one after the France game.

5. Dodson needs to protect Scottish rugby by killing off the World League proposal in committee. It is a disaster for the following reasons:

   1) The tv deal upon which the whole edifice rests is predicated on selling collective rights to pay per view tv. If 6N is taken off free to air it would do huge harm to the tournament and the sustainability of rugby in Scotland. If we have to go down that route we should benefit more than the paltry £6-7m per year bandied around. We own the 6N collectively with the other participants, and have created its value over 100 years. It is not Word Rugby’s to hawk out to sustain Australian rugby (whose revenues exceed our own).

   2) It is a vehicle to force the 6N to introduce relegation every two years. The kicker is that relegated teams would only have opportunity to play other second division teams – for TWO years. This would bankrupt Scottish rugby, force our pro-teams to fold and leave us playing poor teams half of which remain largely amateur. How on earth would we prepare for a promotion play off in these circumstances?

   3) Even on its own terms it is not fit for purpose. It creates a hard ceiling between tier 1 and 2 by preventing tier 2 sides playing those in the division ahead. So Samoa, Tonga, Georgia etc would immediately be deprived of T1 fixtures.

   4) It creates an intolerable burden on player welfare. In June tours players could be expected to fly to Japan, SA and Australia on consecutive weeks. Summer tours would no longer be able to be used for blooding new players or experimenting without greater risk. It is doubtful whether nations with as little depth as Scotland even have the playing resources to play 11 tests a year that demand the strongest side is fielded each time. No summers off after the RWC year.

   5) It diminishes the status of the 6N and RWC. It potentially reduces availability of leading players for domestic tournaments if they play additional play-off matches or require rest periods.

   1. I’ve submitted a petition through parliament website to try and get the government to debate giving greater protection to Six Nations and keep games live on free to air TV. All the home unions get a fair bit of funding from government through sports bodies so only right public gets something in return.
      It would be a travesty if it went to subscription or pay per view.

      1. Any complex negotiation between multiple stakeholders will involve winners and losers. Big winners here are NZ, SA, Aus, Argentina and the two tier 2 sides added to the RC. At a stretch Georgia who have a route to the 6N (although their president has lambasted the proposals).

         Big losers are Scotland and Italy, who are lumped in with the haves despite barely keeping professional rugby afloat, all other tier 2 and 3 sides, and the other 6N sides who suffer opportunity cost of not being allowed to sell their own rights to the product they have created over 100 years of rugby tradition. Not just that but club owners around the world and fans of domestic rugby in NH.

         The fact world rugby now seems to be gearing up to strong arm the NH into participating is shocking. Pichot thinks he’s the champion of the ‘little’ countries but he is a charlatan and is not listening to what tier 2 and 3 sides actually want, or indeed the players or fans. All to fuel his ambition to be president.

         I don’t remember SANZAR bemoaning their financial advantage over Scotland and asking to give us money when we were closing two of our historic districts and being threatened with exclusion from the 6N. The 6N is not theirs to sell so I hope the 6N committee tells them to jog on.

      2. Additional points – I don’t think they have thought through logistics at all.

         If final is held very end November/ early December, presumably the relegation play off would be held same time.

         So you wouldn’t know the participants in the 6N until December for a tournament that kicks off 2 months later. Is that really a good way to run a ‘crown jewel’ tournament?

         Worse, relegation is proposed to happen every other year. Will it be calculated over two year cycles? In which case how do you account for truncated season when tours don’t take place? If it is only based on one season, that disadvantages 6N sides who have 2 instead of 3 home games in seasons with relegation but have 3 home games in seasons without!

         And if we have a full-blooded World League in seasons after RWC, when do players recover? They can’t miss test games anymore, or rest from summer tours, so presumably they don’t participate in domestic rugby?

         The whole thing is a dogs dinner.

6. Pichot has always had a massive chip on his shoulder – small scrum half syndrome writ large.

   Its taken his country over 20yrs to create a pro side and here he is driving such radical change. A “champion” for the small nations whilst blocking access for the PI nations – just another hypocritical politician.

   Once again it’s got nothing to do with growing the game and everything to do with money – Fiji are one of the world stars when it comes to entertaining rugby, in 7s and 15s – but no, lets go with ex gridiron bosh players from the USA – that will really attract new people to the game.

   Every sport tries to crack America and they all fail – they fundamentally do not understand the American psyche, they love their sports and will never take another to their hearts.

   As to the 6Ns – nobody outside Europe understands it from the fans perspective – it’s about decades of visiting countries every 2yrs – going back time and again to the same clubs you first visited 30yrs previously – renewing friendships every 2yrs. Away fans are practically unknown (for obvious reasons) in the SH.

   There is more to rugby than NZ (or the sainted All Blacks as they insist on calling them) and the sooner World Rugby realise this the better.

   1. Funny how every idea Pichot has suits Argentina the most…first it was the 5 years residency, because Argentina didn’t get any immigrants in the 70s and 80s and now can’t attract talent to their only team; now its subsided SH rugby because including Argentina ruined a once-good product, and they are scared to be kicked out; the next “innovation” will probably be playing all games in a ‘New York’ friendly time, needed, you know, to capture the ‘big’ US market, and nothing to do with the fact nobody in Argentina watches games played at 3 AM.

      He’s a pushy little tit…with only one thing on his agenda…Ok maybe 2.

7. Just last one on swearing and kids. I often have the blog on when my kids are around 8 and 10. There not specifically listening but are in earshot.

8. Genuinely disappointed on the swearing, for same reasons as others have raised. Even all the bleeps on the clean version are really off-putting. I’ve also been known to listen to the Pod within my kids’ earshot (6 and 4).

   1. I agree, there is just no need for swearing. In every other aspect this site is ran very professionally. I swear relentlessly through the day but not in certain settings, usually professional and the podcast should aspire to professional standards.

      1. Agreed, cut out the swearing- in fact cut the podcast down to 30 minutes; any sports related radio or TV programme which goes on almost as long as the actual match, fails the test of being properly analytical.

      2. CSC, the podcast is supposed to be more that just analysis of games.

         Maybe you should visit the 1014 guys – warning though, some of their analysis goes over 30mins.

      3. Stu2 Not familiar with the 1014 guys; I’ll listen in. Thanks for that. Part of my point is that in the history of media (newspaper, radio, TV etc.) the function of the editor is to get the maximum information/entertainment into the minimum of space/time. Otherwise you lose audience to the competition. We are living in a fast pace world, with reduced attention span a consequence. Having said all that, keep up the good work.

      4. Their competition are another bunch of guys doing it in their spare time, who were actually on their show a couple of weeks ago.

         There is no media war going on.

      5. I’m fairly sure that the analysis sessions that Toonie et al. undertake are longer than 30 minutes. Are they not analytical? Besides, podcasts are more about entertainment than analysis.

9. To be honest I’m not fussed if there’s swearing or not.

   However I was a little put off by the fact that Iain Hay sounded like he’d had several drinks beforehand! He sounded incoherent at times which I didn’t appreciate, as he’s usually great on the pod.

   1. Iain’s incoherence was down to signal quality on his line. Unfortunately it makes speech sound very slurred sometime. I’m having issues with my internet provider at the minute

10. Apologies as it is not related to this thread, but thoughts on this world league & the rumours circulating about CVC potentially buying at 30 % stake in the six nations ? apparently could lead to 100 m+ windfall for each nation but comes with alot of potential cons, would love to hear from someone with more knowledge on this kind of stuff or perhaps a thread in the near future ?

    1. Take the £100m and use it to get a third pro side up and running I say.

       1. Wouldn’t it be better to use the extra money to keep our best players and invest in a proper club stadium for Edinburgh and Glasgow? Anything left over can go to grassroots / super 6.

       2. Bazz – have to disagree on priorities. CVC will take 6N off free to air. In which case the first priority should be long term investment into the school, youth and community game to future proof rugby union in Scotland. Otherwise we really could see support for the game dwindling here as it is already a niche sport with weak structural foundations.

          After that, we should use it to retain our most senior and marketable players, but we still need a steady stream of players moving on to open up spaces for Scottish players graduating from the academys. Investment in pro-tram facilities also good idea as you suggest.

          ClanFan – A third pro team would be a huge money pit and have a
          negligible impact on improving standards IMO. £100m would not even last a decade once you factor in set up costs and inflation. Then when you get to the end of the windfall you have fixed costs you have no hope of meeting and we will be back to square one.

    2. Ive writtenmy view on the podcast thread about why the world league is a disaster for Scotland.

       However, these details about the CVC deal really underline how poorly the World League proposal rewards the 6N teams for the benefit of controlling broadcast rights to 6N. I expect this story has been placed by 6N committee ahead of the Paris meeting to give prior justification for not backing the World League idea.

11. A couple of where’s Dougie Donnellys, saw Lee Halfpenny on Princes Street on Friday night/early Saturday and Jamie Ritchie unsuccessfully trying to get into Garibaldi’s on Hanover Street the week before, definite queue jumping.